Ep. 59 - Bonds, all the Bonds! part 8

This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:01] J.J.: We are now getting to the James Bond movies that I really, really enjoy of the franchise. It's less of a grind now. It's more looking forward to what's next. We are kind of at the halfway point. I think there's like 11 movies at this point left. We've done 14 Bond movies already. It sounds like we don't like them, but that's not true. Individually, they are always fun and entertaining. We love the franchise. But when you're watching them back-to-back and really paying attention to get your notes and everything... oh boy, is it a tough slog. A lot of them just don't age well. And so now you start to see all of the flaws and all of the things and you're going... yeah, but this is where they really start to pick up.

And not to say we won't still run into some of those things. I don't feel we're going to run into them as much. There's a couple that I'm like, oh boy. They're in the distance, but they're approaching. They're like Omar Sharif in the desert, slowly coming towards. But there are some even in what we're going to discuss today where I was like, are we still... okay. Let's just get right to it. Let's get back to the movie theater so we can talk more about James Bond.

[1:29] J.J.: All right, guys, we are back. And this time we've got a new Bond, Timothy Dalton. Timothy Dalton is finally going to be James Bond after being asked probably about four or five different times. Either he was too young or he wasn't feeling it at the time or he wasn't available. And the irony here is that when it finally came time to replace Roger Moore, he wasn't even the first choice or even the person that was originally cast. And we'll talk a little bit about who was going to be Bond. But before we do that, I know we're going to talk a little bit about the business, some of the ins and outs of it all. Timothy Dalton's first James Bond movie that we're going to be talking about today was The Living Daylights, which doesn't make any sense, but sounds cool. Even him delivering the title of the movie within the movie was done pretty well. Yeah, but still makes no sense. Came out in 1987. Rotten Tomatoes score for The Living Daylights was 72 percent. That's not bad.

[2:50] J.J.: No, it's not bad. Audience score. Sixty-six percent. Okay, that's a little low. I would have expected the audience score to be higher, at least in the 70s. I feel if you were to pull the audience and go, hey, watch this Roger Moore movie, watch A View to a Kill. Now watch The Living Daylights. I think that score would go higher. Not to say A View to a Kill is really low, but I think...

[3:13] Olaf: Why did you have to pick A View to a Kill?

[3:15] J.J.: Because it was his last one, because A View to a Kill was his last one. But this is to my point where he was ahead of his time and underappreciated for what he was doing with the role. Timothy Dalton shows up to play a type of Bond that the world was not expecting or ready for. And honestly, we didn't really get it again until Daniel Craig. And then I guess we were ready for it. We're ready at that point. But this iteration of Bond is closer to what Fleming wanted. Fleming's character in the books.

[3:43] Olaf: Yeah, exactly.

[3:45] J.J.: Director John Glenn is back again. He definitely does better on this one than the last couple that he was part of.

[3:53] Olaf: Agreed.

[3:54] J.J.: Somehow John Barry still kicking. This is his final bow. I think this is it for him.

[4:01] Olaf: I believe you're right.

[4:02] J.J.: As far as the cast goes for The Living Daylights, we like we said, we have Timothy Dalton as James Bond. Everybody's there. Only not many people coming back here. Not a lot of familiar faces. We have Miriam Dabo as Cara Milovi.

[4:20] Olaf: Joran Crabb as General Georgi Koskov.

[4:23] J.J.: Yeah.

[4:24] Olaf: Koskov.

[4:25] J.J.: Yeah. Georgi.

[4:27] Olaf: Georgi Koskov.

[4:29] J.J.: Yeah. I'm butchering these names, by the way. Joe Don Baker is Brad Whittaker. He's not in enough of this movie. I wanted more Joe Don Baker.

[4:35] Olaf: He probably should have been the main villain.

[4:40] J.J.: I completely agree with you. We get John Rhys-Davies.

[4:43] Olaf: Yes, as General Pushkin.

[4:46] J.J.: I just always love John Rhys-Davies. Whenever he shows up in anything, I'm just like, all right, we're classing this place up.

[4:54] Olaf: Yeah, he's one of those guys, a bigger guy. He carries his instruments so well because he's so like in whatever he's in, whether he's Pushkin or he's Salah in Raiders, you love this guy.

[5:06] J.J.: Oh, yes. Whether you're questioning who he is. He brings you in. He's so entertaining.

[5:12] Olaf: Yeah, he really is. Caroline Bliss is our new Moneypenny.

[5:17] J.J.: Even at the tender age of nine when I watched this movie, I thought, she's not good.

[5:22] Olaf: Wow.

[5:23] J.J.: Yeah, I know. I'm being critical here, but they don't do her any favors.

[5:28] Olaf: Yeah, she's given nothing to do.

[5:30] J.J.: She's giving zero to do. She's got a tough hill to climb because Lois Maxwell is the only person that's played this role. Even with the very little she was given, she was able to make something out of it, where this actress had some tough work with very little.

[5:47] Olaf: She didn't bother me. Let me put it this way. She was in like three scenes in this movie, which is about two more than Lois Maxwell usually had in any Bond movie.

[5:57] J.J.: Yeah, that's true, too. John Terry is Felix Leiter.

[6:02] Olaf: Oh, my God. This dude is awful.

[6:05] J.J.: Sorry. The worst Felix Leiter of the franchise.

[6:10] Olaf: This guy was channeling Miami Vice and like a young Michael Bay.

[6:14] J.J.: Well, it's the dad from Lost.

[6:16] Olaf: I know, and I like him in Lost.

[6:18] J.J.: I love him in Lost. I didn't understand him because he was very cool and hip, and he has these sexy Asian bodyguard ladies.

[6:28] Olaf: Yeah, I'm telling you. This was a very Miami Vice version of Felix Leiter. Even the color palette they had him in, the jacket and all of that.

[6:37] J.J.: He was very much kind of a CIA playboy.

[6:40] Olaf: Yes.

[6:41] J.J.: I don't know. It was very bizarre.

[6:45] Olaf: And very random. I'm like, who? You're Felix? No, you're not.

[6:50] J.J.: Yeah. It's like they took the Felix Leiter from Doctor No, then made it too much.

[6:56] Olaf: Yeah, I'm telling you. It was this Miami Vice 80s Jack Lord hybrid.

[7:02] J.J.: Yeah. Then we have Andreas Wisniewski as Necros.

[7:07] Olaf: You're the one who brought it to my attention that he's the brother in Die Hard.

[7:12] J.J.: Exactly.

[7:13] Olaf: And I was like, what are you talking about? And then I went back and I'm like, dude, this is the brother from Die Hard.

[7:19] J.J.: I had no idea.

[7:21] Olaf: You're not a policeman. Policemen have rules. You can't shoot me.

[7:27] J.J.: And he did Die Hard after this, like right after this.

[7:31] Olaf: Yeah.

[7:32] J.J.: And then we also have Art Malik as Cameron Shaw.

[7:35] Olaf: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[7:37] J.J.: A character that I had actually forgotten about as I was watching. I was like, oh, yeah, this guy plays more of an integral part than I thought.

[7:42] Olaf: Yeah. We only get two returning characters, and that's M and Q.

[7:47] J.J.: Yep. That's why I didn't list them. I think it's just funny that the guy who plays M is now like the veteran of the franchise. And this is like his third movie as M, even though this is his fourth movie. He played a different character in Spy Who Loved Me.

[8:00] Olaf: Can we get to the Dalton casting?

[8:02] J.J.: Sure.

[8:03] Olaf: Are we there yet?

[8:04] J.J.: Yeah. So he was asked during the Connery era, during the Roger Moore era, to be Bond. And at this point, before A View to a Kill, he's like, no, I don't know what you guys are doing over there, but I don't want any part of it. So when it came to this one, Pierce Brosnan was on the scene in television doing Remington Steele, and he was the guy.

[8:24] Olaf: Yeah.

[8:25] J.J.: And they were able to get him, but it was sort of this thing where Remington Steele, NBC wasn't going to pick Remington Steele up, and so they had a 60-day window. So they cast Pierce Brosnan as James Bond. I remember seeing Diet Coke commercials on television with Pierce as a James Bond-type character, and these were really cool commercials. Like, he's on a train fighting these dudes with Ninja Stars and stuff, all for a Diet Coke.

[8:52] Olaf: And then NBC, at one point I read that NBC and the studio were trying to work out for him to do both.

[8:58] J.J.: Then it all fell apart.

[8:59] Olaf: It fell apart, and NBC said, no, sorry, we're going to pick up Remington Steele. You can't be Bond.

[9:06] J.J.: They shot like four episodes of Remington Steele and canceled the show.

[9:10] Olaf: Yeah. I mean, it's similar to Tom Selleck in Indiana Jones, except at least Magnum P.I. was super successful.

[9:16] J.J.: And had like a whole decade's worth of like nine seasons or eight seasons.

[9:21] Olaf: Yeah.

[9:22] J.J.: So Pierce Brosnan definitely got kind of screwed on that. But to be fair, I mean, Dalton's been circling this for so long, it was great that he was finally able to do it. This was also the 25th anniversary of Bond when this movie came out.

[9:36] Olaf: And they made a really big push about James Bond was 25 years old.

[9:40] J.J.: We're going to get this new actor to play Bond to try and bring it into the 80s. This is the first time James Bond drives an Aston Martin since On Her Majesty's Secret Service. One of the overall things I enjoyed about The Living Daylights is that this movie did feel very old school Bond, like an espionage.

[10:00] Olaf: Yeah.

[10:01] J.J.: It almost felt like a Connery Bond in terms of setting and story and pace. There was definitely no tongue in cheek, no silliness, as you would like to pull it with Roger Moore.

[10:12] Olaf: There was, but it was very limited and done in a more, like, grounded way.

[10:17] J.J.: Yeah. Even with the intro of the film, where they had four minutes to get the audience to buy into Timothy Dalton as James Bond.

[10:26] Olaf: Yeah.

[10:27] J.J.: This cold open is fun. It's a training exercise for the MI agents. So we have Dalton and two other...

[10:35] Olaf: Yeah, 002 and 004.

[10:38] J.J.: Yeah. And they have to infiltrate this British compound that's on an island.

[10:44] Olaf: Into Gibraltar, like the Rock of Gibraltar is where they are.

[10:47] J.J.: Yeah. So they're going to drop in via parachute. All the soldiers know this is happening. They all have paintball guns to shoot at the agents and whatnot. So I love how M at the beginning is like, all right, guys, like you said, this is an exercise, so let's show them our best and let's show them who we are. They all parachute down, which was a very cool scene. And within five seconds of them landing, one of them gets shot with the paintball.

[11:14] Olaf: Oh, yeah.

[11:15] J.J.: I'm like, you suck.

[11:16] Olaf: Yeah.

[11:18] J.J.: I mean, to be fair, all the agents, including Dalton, get shot by paintball. Now, granted, by the time that Dalton gets hit by a paintball, things have taken a drastic turn. The first guy, he lands and gets taken out in the... I'm like, dude, your 00 status should be revoked.

[11:37] Olaf: Yeah.

[11:38] J.J.: But then the paintball turns lethal. We've got a random dude there that's just killing everybody. But when that second agent falls to his death, you get the turn where you see Dalton and then he's right off to the races like he doesn't have any... you don't have any time to go, oh, here's our guy, because they force him into some action, which allows the audience to try and make a decision of whether or not we're going to like him. And I thought they do a great job with giving him a lot to do. And he's fighting this dude in a truck driving through the base.

[12:10] Olaf: A guard tries to stop the speeding truck with a paintball gun.

[12:13] J.J.: Well, maybe because they think it's still part of the exercise.

[12:16] Olaf: Even still, you're not going to do much with a paintball gun.

[12:19] J.J.: Yeah, no.

[12:20] Olaf: No.

[12:21] J.J.: And then it all ends because the truck is loaded with high explosives and it catches on fire and they drive off of a cliff and he uses his extra parachute to get out of there and lands on a yacht with a beautiful woman.

[12:37] Olaf: One singular yacht.

[12:38] J.J.: Who's just like, oh, I need a real man.

[12:42] Olaf: Yeah.

[12:43] J.J.: Margo, which apparently they dubbed her voice.

[12:45] Olaf: They're dubbing everybody's voices here.

[12:47] J.J.: Yeah. But then we get the opening title song, The Living Daylights.

[12:52] Olaf: Aha.

[12:53] J.J.: I know.

[12:54] Olaf: So good.

[12:55] J.J.: It is good. I like this song, too, especially since Duran Duran's was so good in the previous Bond movie.

[13:02] Olaf: Yeah.

[13:03] J.J.: This one is not as good, but it's still a fun song.

[13:07] Olaf: A pretty good.

[13:08] J.J.: You like The Living Daylights?

[13:10] Olaf: I love both A View to a Kill and The Living Daylights.

[13:13] J.J.: I do, too.

[13:14] Olaf: I don't think it's as good as A View to a Kill, the song.

[13:16] J.J.: See, that's where I'm like, oh, wow.

[13:18] Olaf: Oh.

[13:19] J.J.: I'd say they're pretty equal.

[13:21] Olaf: Oh, I don't know.

[13:23] J.J.: I don't know, man. I mean, I like this song, but Duran Duran's song is, I don't know.

[13:30] Olaf: I feel another list coming on.

[13:35] J.J.: I love them both. Interestingly enough, John Barry, he and Aha had some creative differences.

[13:43] Olaf: But John Barry has famously not enjoyed any of the rock elements of the Bond songs that came before.

[13:50] J.J.: So it's no real surprise. So not only do we get what I feel is, like you said, a really solid cold open, but even this first scene out of the title song is also a really strong piece for Dalton as Bond. We're in Russia. We're at the opera, which all of this feels very Bond.

[14:11] Olaf: And Bond is meeting up with another agent who's sort of kind of running things.

[14:16] J.J.: Sort of.

[14:17] Olaf: Yeah.

[14:18] J.J.: And then it's kind of like pulling power moves. Like, it's a need to know and you don't need to know. But Bond's got the charisma. He's got the know-how and ends up taking over this whole process.

[14:29] Olaf: Yeah.

[14:30] J.J.: And it didn't take long. I forgot about Roger Moore in the first five minutes.

[14:35] Olaf: Like, yeah, I just realized, oh, he's fine. He's going to be all right.

[14:56] J.J.: 90 degree turn in that pipe where I'm like nope.

[15:03] Olaf: Nope, that didn't happen.

[15:05] J.J.: No, he did not make that turn.

[15:08] Olaf: He is still there. We get to Q branch again, and we get a ghetto blaster rocket launcher.

[15:16] J.J.: Which they fire off this boom box into this dummy, and it shreds it to a gazillion pieces. But what you don't know unless you'd like do a deep dive is the person who actually got to set that effect off off back off camera.

[15:30] Olaf: Oh, yeah.

[15:31] J.J.: Was Prince Charles. Prince Charles and Lady Di were on set visiting, and when they shot that scene where the rocket launcher goes off, they let Prince Charles sort of push the button. Yeah, and they let Princess Di smash a fake bottle on his head, which made a lot of news as well. My favorite bit in Q branch was the couch where the guy gets on the couch and then like folds on in and of itself and the dude disappears.

[15:54] Olaf: Yeah, becomes a couch again. We get a whistling keychain. Yeah, it's fun. It's memorable.

[16:06] J.J.: Does he use it? Well, they use it like five times in the whole movie. I mean, they use it a lot. And they do going back to Moneypenny, the reason where I was just like is first of all, there's zero chemistry between the two of them. She tries really hard to hit on him by talking about Barry Manilow records, and I'm like, what are you doing?

[16:24] Olaf: She's doing what the script.

[16:25] J.J.: I know, I'm just saying she wasn't good.

[16:31] Olaf: You know, I'm just saying she's doing what the script.

[16:35] J.J.: I know, I'm just saying she wasn't good.

[16:38] Olaf: Yeah, it's her fault. Wheel in Lois Maxwell and let her deliver the...

[16:44] J.J.: Yeah, and then Dalton can say hello, grandmama.

[16:47] Olaf: Well, she was so great that they gave her five seconds in the next movie, one scene, one line that she was so great in.

[16:54] J.J.: Living Daylight, look, the next movie, it's not even...

[16:58] Olaf: We're not there yet. We're not there yet. I have things to say.

[17:03] J.J.: We get... I love the Bond thug, oh Necros.

[17:11] Olaf: Yeah, Necros, yeah, the villains in this movie aren't great. You got Yorgi and you've got Whitaker, but they're really not doing much. They kind of suck, but Necros is running around, and he's just like your quintessential Bond thug. He's most of the time, he's just...

[17:24] J.J.: He's silent, but he's doing a lot of work.

[17:32] Olaf: Doing a lot. I love the milk bombs he's throwing in the safe house.

[17:42] J.J.: Coming in, well, he's fighting the dude in the kitchen, and you could tell like he's a dancer or something because he's kicking like full extension. The guy's like six-seven, just doing like full-on kicks to the face.

[17:50] Olaf: Yeah, I really love his character, and he's one of my favorite Bond thugs.

[18:01] J.J.: Yeah, he was good. I enjoyed his character as well. He's not as characteristic as like Jaws or...

[18:10] Olaf: Oddjob, but as far as a Bond thug goes, he's fantastic. He only listens to one song though, like every time he's got his Walkman on or he's gonna take somebody out, he's always listening to the same exact song, which apparently got a mention in the opening credits too.

[18:29] J.J.: It's like, where has everybody gone? Or where has everybody gone is the name of the song?

[18:32] Olaf: Yeah, by The Pretenders, but he's listening to it all the time, and they use it. John Barry uses it, the theme with...

[18:38] J.J.: Oh, it's a cassette tape, so it's not like there's a lot of options on there anyway. And we all have our favorite songs, and he's only listening to it right before he kills people.

[18:49] Olaf: So maybe that's his song. That's how he gets pumped up.

[18:55] J.J.: Yeah, it's in the zone. Oh, I love how for one movie we had M kind of liking Bond, which was like A View to a Kill, right? We mentioned it. We're like all of a sudden not anymore. M is back to yelling at Bond.

[19:07] Olaf: Give it, you know what? I'm gonna give the assignment to somebody else who can follow orders and not go off hunches.

[19:13] J.J.: Just not willing to help Bond because Koskoff gives his theory as to why he defects, and he's like, this is why I'm defecting because Pushkin has this directive to eliminate whatever this, that, and the other, so we need to get rid of him. And Bond is like, I'm not buying that because we both know Pushkin, and M's like, I know him too. This is what you need to do, follow orders. And I'm like, so much for M liking Bond because he doesn't like him anymore.

[19:35] Olaf: Yeah, maybe the actor just really loved Roger Moore, and then he's like, who's this upstart?

[19:42] J.J.: Who's this guy? Yeah, it is strange because he doesn't like him that much in this movie, and then he really doesn't like him in the next one.

[19:51] Olaf: Which, no, we barely get any of that. Anyway, I love the cello. I think it plays well, and I think it's funny. And then the car. I love this car. It's so cool. It's like we're back to really being Bond, and we've got a cool Bond car.

[20:04] J.J.: Yeah, with cool gadgets, and the car chase was great. It's so fun. It's great. You got the gadgets, you've got the Bond girl in the car going, oh my, what did he do? And oh my gosh, going on, and then it ends with the cello case sled, and yeah, it's great.

[20:28] Olaf: I'm glad that they brought the Aston Martin back. This Aston Martin is very cool, and this whole sequence is also like when he drives into the barn or the out, whatever that is, and then they have to...

[20:37] J.J.: What, we gotta leave?

[20:39] Olaf: Yeah, and then as they're driving out though, it explodes in the back, and it's so cool. It's madness. Broccoli didn't think that the cello thing would work. He was like, two people can't fit in this thing.

[20:49] J.J.: Yeah, and so John Glenn was like, yeah, we can, and he brought one into his office and set like two bodies inside the cello case, and it's like, see, we're gonna do this. And I thought it was cool too.

[21:03] Olaf: Yeah, it's fun. And then sliding under the guard post, we have nothing to declare except this cello is very funny.

[21:08] J.J.: So Bond meets up with his agent friend again, who is now clearly like, you were better than me. I'm here to help you now, and they're supposed to meet at a carnival, only Bond can show up to a carnival in a tuxedo, and it works.

[21:26] Olaf: Yeah, it doesn't seem out of place at all that he's walking around a carnival at midnight.

[21:29] J.J.: Yeah, in a tuxedo. What I did find funny was Bond goes to the shooting gallery, and the guy that's running the gallery like begs him to stop playing.

[21:37] Olaf: Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, he's just so good. Please stop.

[21:45] J.J.: He's winning all the take a prize. Get out of here, go.

[21:50] Olaf: So he has to meet his agent friend, and Necros shows up and sabotages the sliding door, which apparently nobody sees him do.

[21:56] J.J.: Nobody sees him do it, and unlike most sliding doors that I'm aware of, this runs on a super high pneumatic pressure gauge to open and close the door.

[22:12] Olaf: Yes, so that way the agent goes to leave, it smashes him. That was hilarious because this rod and piston thing running the door is just huge.

[22:23] J.J.: It's like, it's a sliding door. I'm like, I don't remember any sliding door running like that back in the day.

[22:32] Olaf: No, I didn't really. That sort of thing didn't really, like even now rewatching it, I was more like, how was he able to put this thing, this device on this door with nobody questioning him in any way?

[22:43] J.J.: Well, they were like, oh, he's got a Walkman. He must work here. Yeah, he's got balloons. He's the balloon guy who's also in charge of fixing the door.

[22:50] Olaf: Yeah, I have a note here that says dude gets knocked out by a tin bucket lightly bonked on his head.

[22:56] J.J.: That's when they're in the jail.

[23:01] Olaf: Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A lot of the plot is hard to understand.

[23:04] J.J.: Yeah, the way they shot this movie, it kind of felt like they knew that the plot was a bit convoluted and confusing, so they just kind of kept throwing stuff at you right when yours might start questioning, wait, what's happening? Something happens to distract you. Yorgi assumes that Bond kills Cara?

[23:24] Olaf: I'm assuming, I'm assumed so because Yorgi has no idea that Cara is alive, even though Necros does because he sees Bond with her. So when she calls Whitaker and then subsequently talks to Yorgi, he's very shocked that she's on the other end of the phone because then she double crosses him.

[23:41] J.J.: I felt like the Bond girl in this movie, much like the villains in this movie, are subpar. Now, is she a step up from A View to a Kill? Absolutely. She's just an innocent in all of this who was pressured into doing something, right? Because she even calls him and she's like, I don't know what to do.

[24:00] Olaf: Yeah.

[24:00] J.J.: And so then she's fed this line that Bond is a KGB agent and all this other stuff, and then yes, Yorgi ends up double-crossing both of them, and they end up in Afghanistan, which I thought was also of the time because it was the '80s and Afghanistan and the Soviet Union had their things going on. But yes, they get to the jail.

[24:18] Olaf: Yeah, Bond and Cara get arrested in Afghanistan.

[24:24] J.J.: In Afghanistan, they break out and attack the guard, and it's so silly because they're kind of wrestling, and you see plain as day the guard gets tapped on the head by this tin bucket, not hard, not smashed on him or anything, knocks him right out, lays about flat. He is out for the count.

[24:42] Olaf: Yep. Yeah, in my notes, because we were just talking about, I had the plot, dot, dot, dot, dot, not really sure.

[24:50] J.J.: Right, because, and this is where we said earlier, I would have liked more Whitaker because Whitaker was the through line, the arms part of it, the smuggling weapons and great, but he was just sort of an afterthought, the sort of second.

[25:04] Olaf: They did reshoots at the end of the movie and added him in.

[25:07] J.J.: So we find out that the guy that they also help escape from the prison is British. He's British, but he's also Middle Eastern, and he's also in charge of this whole guerrilla group that are fighting against the Russians.

[25:15] Olaf: Right, so they team up with Bond, and then they attack the airfield. They got a huge jet that's loading cargo with all the drugs.

[25:28] J.J.: With all the, yeah, the drugs. Okay, Bond gets on the plane, and he takes the plane over, but when he got on, he never closed the door that he went.

[25:43] Olaf: No, he just left it open.

[25:50] J.J.: He left it open, conveniently left it open. Yeah, which you would think that's something you want to close before you're about to take off.

[25:52] Olaf: I'm trying to figure out what his plan was because he had already activated the bomb that was on the same plane that he was on.

[26:03] J.J.: Well, originally he was going to just get on with the bomb, activate it, and get off, right? Blow it up, but then he got stuck on the plane.

[26:08] Olaf: So then he ended up turning the bomb off, but he did not right away.

[26:15] J.J.: Not right away, but that's my point. He was driving the plane down the runway trying to evade whoever, but the bomb is still ticking.

[26:21] Olaf: Yeah, what was his plan to just drive the plane somewhere else and then get off and let it blow up? I don't understand what he was doing there because then he lets Cara on.

[26:32] J.J.: Well, I think at that point the gig was up, so he's just trying to... This is where you were mentioned the plot. He's trying to get the plane away from Yorgi and Necros.

[26:42] Olaf: He should have just run away from the plane.

[26:46] J.J.: He's just, yeah, I guess. Yeah, because they don't know the bomb is there, right? And so then he's like, I'm gonna disarm the bomb, and the whole time I'm thinking, you're in the air, just throw it out of the plane. You're in the desert, it's gonna blow up, but conveniently he's unable to do that because then he has to fight Necros, which I love this bit.

[27:00] Olaf: That's a great...

[27:01] J.J.: Always stuck with me as a kid with them hanging out the back of the plane on the big net full of...

[27:09] Olaf: Yeah, the drugs and everything.

[27:15] J.J.: Drugs, yeah, and then it comes down to Necros holding on to his boot, which he easily could have let go of him, held back onto the ropes.

[27:18] Olaf: Yeah, the stunt outside the plane is great. I don't think the final shoelace cut was necessary because they'd cut so many parts of the laces that shoe was not staying on.

[27:28] J.J.: No, and he didn't miss. He didn't need to be holding it. It was so...

[27:35] Olaf: Dramatic.

[27:40] J.J.: Dramatic and slow, you know what's happening? And he's just like holding that boot watching, and then there's the one lace left, which I don't know.

[27:51] Olaf: Yeah.

[27:54] J.J.: Yeah, I know.

[27:56] Olaf: So then he's got to disarm the bomb, which he does with like three seconds left, and then he goes, well, now I got to arm it again because I got to throw it off to help the Afghans.

[28:05] J.J.: Yeah, because the bridge perfectly timed drop to blow up the bomb.

[28:09] Olaf: Yeah, right on the bridge. Yeah, I wrote down this Bond girl, all she really does is create the problems in the movie that Bond then she does to fix all of them.

[28:19] J.J.: She's part of the problem.

[28:21] Olaf: So when Necros gets on the plane, Yorgi's left behind in the truck, and then Yorgi is in a truck that explodes, and he survives with no, no nothing.

[28:30] J.J.: Scratch on his forehead, like a little bit of blood.

[28:35] Olaf: Yeah, I know, I know.

[28:40] J.J.: He should have been dead, but I know he's just like, oh, what happened?

[28:47] Olaf: Yeah, and then we get one final scene with Felix. I don't understand why they can't find a decent actor to play Felix. They have Jack Lord and Hedison, who we'll see in a minute. They get one final scene with Felix unnecessarily, and then we get this Whitaker fight that lasts about 30 seconds, but I love how all of the historical figures in Whitaker's are all of him.

[29:08] J.J.: Yeah, just dressed up as different.

[29:16] Olaf: He's got all the generals, but it's...

[29:18] J.J.: Leaders, I thought it was hilarious. The place is just littered with weapons and toys and everything. It's a cool place.

[29:25] Olaf: It was wasted, man.

[29:26] J.J.: I really was Whitaker because this fight is very short, but it could have been shorter because Whitaker shows up with his gun that's got a shield on the front.

[29:34] Olaf: I know, he's like nothing compares to this body armor, and I'm like, it's just protecting your face.

[29:39] J.J.: It's a very small shield, and yet only shoots at the shoes.

[29:44] Olaf: I'm like, shoot him in the leg, shoot him in the stomach, shoot him in the chest, anywhere, literally.

[29:52] J.J.: So many options where you could shoot him. Bigger pieces of the body you could be hitting.

[29:57] Olaf: Yeah, and he's a big guy. Yeah.

[30:00] J.J.: Well, and then the way Whittaker goes down, like they use the wolf whistle that Q mentions, it's got an explosive element, this keychain.

[30:06] Olaf: Yeah.

[30:09] J.J.: So he sticks it on this bust and he whistles and it explodes and that's what takes Whittaker out.

[30:15] Olaf: I just thought it was thrown together poorly.

[30:20] J.J.: Yeah, it was very anticlimactic.

[30:22] Olaf: You wouldn't think that that would have killed Whittaker.

[30:25] J.J.: Right, but you would have knocked him out. And maybe not.

[30:28] Olaf: And Yorgi doesn't die.

[30:32] J.J.: No.

[30:34] Olaf: He's one of the few villains that does not die.

[30:38] J.J.: Well, I mean, he died. Well, he does.

[30:43] Olaf: He died in that Jeep when it exploded.

[30:46] J.J.: And he will die later because he's basically going to be sent back in a bag.

[30:49] Olaf: Yeah. Yeah, they had to have John Rhys-Davies show up again and basically say, I'm going to kill you. We get General Gogol for one more scene in this last movie at the very end. And they mentioned one line earlier that, oh, who's Pushkin? Well, he's the one who replaced General Gogol.

[31:00] J.J.: And I just thought how ironic that they've given us General Gogol for five movies, basically doing nothing in any of these movies. And they finally create a story where his character would have been Pushkin, but I think the actor wasn't feeling well. I think he was ill.

[31:16] Olaf: Something like that. And so they just sort of gave him this final scene at the end. I mean, he'd been basically the face of the KGB.

[31:24] J.J.: Right. So, you know, why not? And then the movie ends. Well, we get the final party and the rebels from Afghanistan show up to the party for no reason at all.

[31:34] Olaf: And they were trying to go to the concert and they couldn't because they got stopped at the airport.

[31:39] J.J.: But they're completely decked out in their bullets and everything. And I'm like, that's all they got. How did you even get into the country?

[31:44] Olaf: You're a light airport security. And then there's the closing credit song.

[31:54] J.J.: I put that, that, that, that. Not great.

[31:56] Olaf: No, it's not. It's another pretender song.

[32:00] J.J.: But it is so bad. It's bad.

[32:03] Olaf: It makes no sense. It's all over the place. I was like, is there a beat in this song?

[32:08] J.J.: This movie, I did not like this movie as much as License to Kill. I do not like this movie as much as License to Kill, but I thought it was a really good movie to introduce Timothy Dalton as James Bond because he is given a lot to do and he is able to solidify himself as 007 as James Bond.

[32:26] Olaf: I've always liked both Dalton movies, but I had a distinct memory of liking License to Kill more than Living Daylights. But then when I rewatched these, I actually like Living Daylights more than License to Kill. And I have and it's probably because I have issues with License to Kill.

[32:44] J.J.: Well, from a traditional Bond sense, Living Daylights fits the bill for no question.

[32:48] Olaf: That is not the case with License to Kill. But I find License to Kill way more interesting and way more entertaining and way more enjoyable.

[32:56] J.J.: Well, it's Bond takes a holiday. It's one step away from never say never again. But there's there are certain reasons why.

[33:04] Olaf: Let's get into it. License to Kill follows up two years later, 1989. Rotten Tomatoes score 79 percent. Audience score 62 percent.

[33:14] J.J.: See, and I think that's traditional purist Bond fan going. This is not a Bond movie, per se, because I think this is a really strong movie. I mean, I think Timothy Dalton was great in the movie. I just I didn't like the story. I didn't like the locations and most of the characters.

[33:32] Olaf: And there's a lot of reasons why they had to do what they had to do to make this movie the way they made it.

[33:39] J.J.: Yeah. We've got John Glenn yet again as our director. Number five. Final time. The composer for this one is Michael Kamen. He's done Lethal Weapon, Robin Hood. He's done quite a lot of movies.

[33:53] Olaf: And he's got some great, great scores underneath.

[33:56] J.J.: Can you die hard also?

[33:57] Olaf: He might have done die hard, too. I think. Yeah, I think he did.

[34:00] J.J.: For the cast, we have Carrie Lowell as Pam Bouvier, who.

[34:04] Olaf: Solid Bond girl. Oh, my God. She's one of my favorites.

[34:07] J.J.: She is. She is great.

[34:09] Olaf: She is one of my favorites. Robert Davi is Fran Sanchez.

[34:13] J.J.: Also a fantastic villain.

[34:17] Olaf: Yes, he was a good villain. Talisa Soto is Lupe Lamora.

[34:25] J.J.: Snore. Frank McRae as Sharky.

[34:29] Olaf: I've always loved him. Battery's not included.

[34:32] J.J.: Battery's not included. Hidden forgotten gem.

[34:38] Olaf: Yeah. So many other great roles he's done. And they're all very similar, but that's fine. I just want to give him a big hug. I want to hang out with him.

[34:41] J.J.: Yeah, you do.

[34:43] Olaf: Wayne Newton as Professor Joe Butcher.

[34:46] J.J.: Yeah, he wrote a letter into the studio like, can I just get a cameo? I've always wanted to be in a Bond movie. And that's how he got this.

[34:54] Olaf: Yeah. Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't think this is a debut, but we have Benicio del Toro as Dario.

[35:02] J.J.: Oh, Benicio del Toro. I don't know if this is his first movie, but he was 21.

[35:06] Olaf: Yeah, he's very young.

[35:07] J.J.: So he's the youngest Bond villain henchman.

[35:10] Olaf: I don't think he's given a lot to do, but he's great in the scenes that he's in.

[35:15] J.J.: David Hedison as Felix Leiter. He's back, guys.

[35:19] Olaf: Finally. We got our real Felix back.

[35:22] J.J.: Finally. The only actor to play Felix Leiter against two different Bonds.

[35:28] Olaf: Yeah. Everett McGill as Ed Killefer.

[35:31] J.J.: Yes. Anthony Zerbe as Milton Crest. And Anthony Stark as Truman Lodge.

[35:38] Olaf: It is widely and incorrectly rumored that this was Timothy Dalton's last James Bond film due to it being financially disappointing. In fact, Dalton was supposed to be in a third Bond film titled Property of a Lady.

[35:50] J.J.: Which is what in Octopussy, that's what the Fabergé egg was called.

[35:56] Olaf: Yeah.

[35:56] J.J.: Property of a Lady.

[35:57] Olaf: But unfortunately, there were a bunch of legal issues with MGM beginning that year. It created huge delays, which eventually led to Dalton just saying, you know what, I'm done.

[36:09] J.J.: Well, and as a kid, I didn't know any of the legalities of it. I just knew because of how my brain works. Every two years, a James Bond movie comes out. And it's 1990, 19, it's going to be 1991. And Timothy Dalton is about to be in a movie called Rocketeer. So I guess we're not getting a James Bond movie.

[36:27] Olaf: Yeah.

[36:28] J.J.: That's how I, that's how my brain works.

[36:29] Olaf: Wow.

[36:30] J.J.: And then.

[36:31] Olaf: How old were you?

[36:31] J.J.: And then I was 13.

[36:33] Olaf: Yeah. Fun. So fun.

[36:36] J.J.: And then, well, no, because I'm like Bond, man. Oh man, Rocketeer. This is great.

[36:41] Olaf: Yeah, I wasn't thinking about that stuff then.

[36:43] J.J.: But then, but then more time passed and I was like, where's, what's the deal with Timothy Dalton? And then he was going to be in this Gone with the Wind sequel. And that's when he decided.

[36:53] Olaf: Yeah, 1994, he announces his retirement.

[36:56] J.J.: Yeah.

[36:57] Olaf: He did at the very last moment say, I would, I'd like to come back. But by then, the machine had already moved on with Pierce Brosnan.

[37:07] J.J.: Well, and they were going to, he would have had to have committed to more than one and he didn't want to do that either.

[37:12] Olaf: Of all the Bond films, this one has the largest role for Desmond Llewellyn as Q.

[37:18] J.J.: Which was so great.

[37:19] Olaf: In fact, he says that of all the Bond films he's done, this is the one he made money on.

[37:25] J.J.: Yeah, because this is when I made money. Yeah, exactly. It's exactly right. It has also been gone on record as John Glenn has said, this is his most, his favorite or his best of the movies he directed.

[37:35] Olaf: I didn't mind the story of this movie. I didn't mind the locations of this movie. I thought they did what they had to do to get this thing off the ground.

[37:43] J.J.: I mean, as far as License to Kill and Living Daylights, they are John Glenn's best. I still like this movie, but I thought I liked it more until I watched it again. And I was like, I have a lot of issues with this. Like I, for whatever reason, I just don't like Bond in the Florida Keys for the, basically the whole movie. It was Bond takes a holiday to the keys and gets up to some shenanigans.

[38:09] Olaf: And it's exactly, that's a great way of putting a brief synopsis on it is James Bond is at his friend Felix's wedding and then things go sideways and he has to avenge his friend's wife's death and all this other stuff.

[38:34] J.J.: I do like this cold open too, by the way.

[38:36] Olaf: Yeah, it's a great cold open. Felix is getting married and they decide that they're going to parachute out of a helicopter to arrive at the wedding. Was that always the plan?

[38:47] J.J.: No, it wasn't. No, they were driving there and the helicopter shows up and says, ah, the Sanchez is moving.

[38:55] Olaf: He's in the Bahamas. We can go get him.

[38:56] J.J.: Okay. I forgot about that.

[38:57] Olaf: Yeah, of course. Because they introduce, in this cold open, you get introduced to the villain, you get introduced to the girlfriend, and then you get this unrealistic, but in very Bond way, they're going to go fishing and they're going to hook their helicopter to the plane that Sanchez has somehow escaped in.

[39:16] J.J.: While the bride is waiting, because now Felix is running very late, they make, they cut to a scene about them waiting. And it seems as though the limo is literally driving in circles around the church until Felix shows up when it's like, why? Just hang out in the, just park in front. You don't need to drive in circles.

[39:37] Olaf: Yeah, just park and go and wait in the, the church has probably got a back room where you can just hang out.

[39:42] J.J.: Be comfortable. The dad is in the back and he's clearly pissed off.

[39:48] Olaf: He is not happy at all.

[39:51] J.J.: And then Felix is on this drug bust and they're like, Bond, you have to hang out. You can't.

[39:58] Olaf: Because you can't do anything.

[39:59] J.J.: And it's not his jurisdiction.

[40:01] Olaf: Yeah. And that lasts for like five seconds.

[40:04] J.J.: No, while he gets shot at, he's got to defend himself.

[40:06] Olaf: Yeah. And then, yeah, Sanchez is trying to escape in a plane and somehow the helicopter is able to keep up with the plane, fly over the plane, hook it, hook the tail and yeah.

[40:19] J.J.: And then overpower it. And yeah.

[40:21] Olaf: We get a great, another great theme song. I've always been a fan of this theme song sung by Gladys Knight.

[40:25] J.J.: This is Maurice Bender's last title sequence as well.

[40:31] Olaf: It's good. It's yeah. It's a great opening.

[40:34] J.J.: This Bond movie is somewhat of an end of an era because it's the last Bond movie where regardless of who the actor is, that's playing Bond. The story is all connected from Dr. No to this.

[40:47] Olaf: Yeah.

[40:47] J.J.: In terms of canon.

[40:49] Olaf: They're mentioned, they mention his wife and everything.

[40:51] J.J.: He got me, he was married a long time ago.

[40:53] Olaf: Did you notice that Felix's wife has more chemistry with Bond than with Felix?

[41:01] J.J.: Like there, there's a couple scenes.

[41:03] Olaf: There's not just one.

[41:04] J.J.: There's a couple scenes where I'm just like, uh, Felix, you might want to watch out.

[41:09] Olaf: Watch out. It's a good thing Bond lives in London.

[41:11] J.J.: They are very close.

[41:13] Olaf: Yeah. She played Terry on Three's Company.

[41:15] J.J.: But I completely agree. There's moments there where she's hitting on him, like at the house after the ceremony. I'm like, uh, what now?

[41:23] Olaf: It's, she's hanging all over him at one point.

[41:26] J.J.: All over him.

[41:27] Olaf: Go.

[41:27] J.J.: Yeah.

[41:28] Olaf: Okay.

[41:28] J.J.: But they do a good job of like, Felix has this one scene with, with Pam, with Carrie Lowell's character.

[41:33] Olaf: You don't know what's going on, but they have this one moment in his office where some sort of business is going down.

[41:39] J.J.: I know.

[41:40] Olaf: Sanchez bribes Killiford to, for the escape.

[41:43] J.J.: Yeah, Sanchez breaks out and goes back, kills Felix's wife, feeds Felix to the sharks, and somehow he survives.

[41:50] Olaf: I love Benicio's line where he's like, nice honeymoon.

[41:56] J.J.: We give her a nice honeymoon.

[41:58] Olaf: He, I can tell you, man, he chews up so much scenery, but he doesn't do it in this cheesy way.

[42:04] J.J.: No, no.

[42:05] Olaf: Like he's, you just don't like him.

[42:07] J.J.: Yeah.

[42:07] Olaf: So while this is happening, Bond is going to the airport. He's gonna go home.

[42:12] J.J.: He just leaves the car.

[42:13] Olaf: So I wrote this down. I wrote this down. Bond arrives at the airport.

[42:17] J.J.: He pulls up to the front and just leaves the car.

[42:21] Olaf: He goes in, he's getting his ticket, and he's about to go on the plane. So I'm like, you just leave the car there? You leave your car there.

[42:26] J.J.: I one thought of, well, maybe he's going to check in and drop his bags off and then go back. That was the only thing I could possibly think of.

[42:34] Olaf: But that still was like, that makes really no sense.

[42:40] J.J.: But then you realize, no, it's just more of a, he's going to, we're going to need the actor to get back in the car to go back to Felix's house.

[42:47] Olaf: Somehow it didn't get towed or picked up by the rental service.

[42:52] J.J.: Or he couldn't have just.

[42:52] Olaf: Because he runs back out and he drives that back to Felix's place.

[42:56] J.J.: Back to Felix's house.

[42:57] Olaf: But yeah, I had to, I had to write that down because it's like, what about the car? Because it's so noticeable.

[43:03] J.J.: And what I love too is he leaves it there and there are two guards, like security guys right there.

[43:08] Olaf: Yeah.

[43:09] J.J.: Even back then, like when you could still go to the gate with the person that's flying and all that stuff, you're not leaving a car parked.

[43:19] Olaf: Nope.

[43:19] J.J.: So then we cut back to later on and I had to write down, why is Killifer still hanging around?

[43:26] Olaf: Why has he not skipped town at this point?

[43:29] J.J.: Because Sanchez has arranged for somebody to get him out of there.

[43:33] Olaf: Okay.

[43:33] J.J.: So that's why he said, it's like, Hey, the bus, the bus or the boat's going to come to get you in three hours.

[43:39] Olaf: He's like, good. I'm like, a lot of time is I want to get out of here.

[43:41] J.J.: It's like, oh, I know. Like it's been at least a day.

[43:44] Olaf: So Bond gets there at night and he, or no Killifer pulls a gun on him.

[43:48] J.J.: Yeah.

[43:49] Olaf: And then Sharky, all this other stuff.

[43:51] J.J.: Killifer finds himself hanging over the shark, right?

[43:53] Olaf: Yeah.

[43:53] J.J.: So he says, there's 2 million in there. I'll split it with you. And it's a pretty heavy suitcase, I suppose. But Killifer, if you're holding on for dear life with two hands to whatever it is you're holding on to, if somebody threw something at you, I don't care how heavy it is. Are you going to try and grab onto it? Because that's exactly what he does.

[44:11] Olaf: Yeah, classic greedy, bad guy.

[44:13] J.J.: Greedy move. I want to try and save the money and I'm going to try and save myself at the same time.

[44:17] Olaf: Well, I think he was just thinking of the money because I don't even think he tried to hold on to the chain with one hand and catch it. It was just like, dude, let the money go.

[44:28] J.J.: Yeah. So Bond just wreaks havoc and then M shows up and takes over the Hemingway house.

[44:34] Olaf: I know.

[44:35] J.J.: Oh, I'm sorry. Did you have a tour scheduled today? It's not happening.

[44:40] Olaf: This is now property of the British government.

[44:48] J.J. Gonzalez: Welcome back to another episode of "Back to the Movie Theater." Today, we’re diving into the world of James Bond, specifically focusing on Timothy Dalton's era.

[45:00] Olaf Adsit: That's right! Dalton brought a different vibe to the character, didn't he? A bit more serious and intense compared to his predecessors.

[45:17] J.J. Gonzalez: Absolutely! We're covering "The Living Daylights" and "Licence to Kill" today. Let's start with "The Living Daylights." What were your initial thoughts on it?

[45:47] Olaf Adsit: I thought it was a great introduction to Dalton as Bond. The action sequences were top-notch, and the plot had some interesting twists.

[46:17] J.J. Gonzalez: I agree! The opening sequence with the cello was quite memorable. It set the tone for a more serious Bond right away.

[46:47] Olaf Adsit: And the way they handled the character of Kara Milovy was refreshing. She wasn't just a damsel in distress; she had her own agency.

[47:17] J.J. Gonzalez: Exactly! It was nice to see a Bond girl who could hold her own. What did you think of the villain, Brad Whitaker?

[47:47] Olaf Adsit: Whitaker was an interesting choice. He had that classic villain vibe, but I felt like he could have been developed a bit more.

[48:17] J.J. Gonzalez: True, but I think the focus was more on the action and the espionage elements. The chase scenes were fantastic!

[48:39] Olaf Adsit: They really were! The car chase through the streets of Vienna was a highlight for me. It felt very Bond-like.

[48:47] J.J. Gonzalez: Definitely! And the way Dalton portrayed Bond was refreshing. He brought a more rugged and serious demeanor.

[49:17] Olaf Adsit: Right! It was a nice change from the charm of Roger Moore. Dalton's Bond felt more grounded.

[49:47] J.J. Gonzalez: Speaking of grounded, let's talk about "Licence to Kill." This film took a darker turn, didn't it?

[50:17] Olaf Adsit: It did! The revenge plot was much more personal, and it really showcased Dalton's range as an actor.

[50:47] J.J. Gonzalez: I loved how the film explored Bond's loyalty and the consequences of his actions. It added depth to the character.

[51:17] Olaf Adsit: Absolutely! And the villain, Franz Sanchez, was one of the more memorable ones. He was ruthless and had a strong presence.

[51:47] J.J. Gonzalez: For sure! The way he treated his henchmen was brutal. It made him a formidable foe for Bond.

[52:17] Olaf Adsit: And the action sequences in "Licence to Kill" were intense! The tanker chase was a standout moment.

[52:47] J.J. Gonzalez: That was epic! It felt like a culmination of everything Dalton's Bond had been building up to.

[53:17] Olaf Adsit: I think both films really showcased the versatility of the Bond franchise. Dalton's portrayal was unique and memorable.

[53:47] J.J. Gonzalez: Agreed! It's a shame he only did two films. I would have loved to see more of his take on the character.

[54:17] Olaf Adsit: Same here! But I think he left a lasting impact on the franchise. His Bond was a nice bridge between the classic and modern eras.

[54:47] J.J. Gonzalez: Well said! And that wraps up our discussion on Timothy Dalton's Bond. Until next time, follow us on our social media, check us out on YouTube, and as always, to be continued!

[59:07] Johnny Clay: Back to the Movie Theater is hosted by J.J. Gonzalez and Olaf Adsit. Produced by me, Johnny Clay, J.J. Gonzalez, and Olaf Adsit. Theme song and incidental music by The Dimes.

[59:19] Johnny Clay: Visit us at bttmtpodcast.com for trivia playalongs, merch, and more. That's bttmtpodcast.com.

[59:29] Johnny Clay: Follow us on Instagram and TikTok, and find us on YouTube at Back to the Movie Theater, with J.J. and Olaf.